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Thoughts on Injustice

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1 Thoughts on Injustice on Sun Apr 28, 2013 10:27 pm

Edge

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So I figured it'd be nice to have a good discussion on Injustice in general. I'm hoping we can get the clan up and running again. The opportunity is here to start fresh, and active forum discussion is going to attract more players and start levelling us up faster.

SO.. I'll kick things off with my thoughts and a breakdown of the game. Hopefully you'll all share yours too!

Story

Story was first thing I did.. Beat it in like 6 hours on Medium. Nothing too difficult, barely lost any fights. Admittedly I was just button mashing (sort of) while figuring out movement and timing for cancels etc. Learning their launchers, specials and generally getting a feel for the game. I didn't play much of the demo (maybe an hour or two on release) and I wanted to try everyone out before picking a char and learning them.
The story was okay I guess. The plot was cliche, the voice acting was bad, the dialogue was bad, I felt it was quite childish (but so was MK I guess), but despite all this I did find it quite entertaining and joker/harlee were extremely amusing.

Gameplay

It feels completely different to MK.. It really is a new game. I liked block button, dash block and dash cancel. It gave you much more control over your spacing and more control over combos. What if I wanted to juggle with dash 1 dash 1 dash 1 dash 1 slide to troll? It was also useful for suspending the gravity and controlling combos more easily, or even to tag on that extra 2%. Because of the elimination of this, I feel combo options are more linear and the timing is more strict.
I miss my breaker and although I havn't played online yet, I don't think I'm going to prefer the clash system. Not fond of the jump in system either.. It just feels like you have less control in general, but I know I'll get used to it in time.
I love the trait system and the interactive environment. Each character feels unique and complex and I can't wait to see how certain players match up.

Overall

I'm not interested in much to do with this game other than the competetive side online, maybe offline if it goes that far. I'm just gonna muscle through all the side stuff to unlock everything, hittin the labs in between with my main - Killer Frost. Then when I'm done with that I'll be getting online with it. I am so psyched.. I picked KF as my main before I even had the game (SZ tribute) and I hit the TyM KF forum today for the first time to find out she's broken as shit : D Get this.. She has a 40% standing reset (like sonyas or Skarlets), she has a 50/50 VORTEX like Scorp's except imagine his B2 and F3 being completely SAFE on block which leads to a 94-100% damage, With 1 bar she can combo you from ANYWHERE on the screen, and her she can get around 65% in a single combo with her trait. Oh also she has zoning and anti-zoning capabilities. OH and also several frame traps with her trait-cancel. Gonna enjoy beating y'all down with my potentially top-tier char ;D.

How have you all been finding it? Do you think you'll like it more than MK?

2 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Sun Apr 28, 2013 11:06 pm

Shadow

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Wild Ape
Personally, I found MK a lot more fluid and smoother. I'm not a fan of the jump-in system, it just feels awkward for me. Right now I'm having such a hard time punishing, but that might just be my character. I block a move, try to punish, but get hit. Either that or half of my punish doesn't come out, for example if I did 1,1,3, only the first 1 would come out. Seems a lot of my inputs are just disappearing, not sure why.

Online loses the fun for me, but then again so does the CPU on hard. Getting in on zoning is tough without an air dash or teleport; Green Arrow vs Deathstroke is a nightmare for me atm.

Arrow's super is probably the best thing about him. He can get 75% from a basic combo from it, or 102% situational. He can make it inescapable after 1,1,1 on block I think. Killer Frost looks sick ! Was going to learn her myself.

Right now I'm torn between loving the game and being annoyed at it. Oh, and I know my post is all over the place with topics, but whatever (:

3 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Mon Apr 29, 2013 2:37 am

Shadow

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Wild Ape
Also seems like the community is just as bad as it was in MK9, -sigh-

Edit: Oh, and I hate the blocking in this game, too.

4 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Mon Apr 29, 2013 10:28 am

misskiss88

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I agree with both of you! Im quite disappointed at the game really:p it feels much less smooth to play than mk. And I HATE that there isnt a block button! It will take forever for me to stop pushing R2 instead of b... The traits adds spice to the game but I cant hate the transitions and interactebles more than I do... I get the whole unique matches thing but im just getting annoyed with them... And why the fuck are they unblockable??! Lol, PMS much?Wink

The story mode was ok, I got confused at times but that is probably because ive never heard of half of the cast;)

I like that you can practice online and display moves on the screen while practicing! Good for a noob with a short time memory like me;)

I will probably like the game more when i get the hang of it.

5 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Mon Apr 29, 2013 12:59 pm

Darkseid

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Wild Ape
I was so worried when I found out that you can't dash cancel, almost didn't play the demo at all, but I adjusted to it and am now loving this game to death! Already liking it much more than MK, probably because I seem to do MUCH better at it than I did at MK. Funny though that all my mains happen to be either top tier or just cheap cunts. lol

I love that every character has a trait that makes them unique, mirror matches are much more annoying though. I absolutely hate interactables, and if it wasn't for pretty much everyone I'm fighting, I'd turn them off every single match. The block button really fucked me over, actually it still does sometimes. Cross ups are very weird to block and sadly, cross ups are very important in Injustice.

Really enjoyed story mode, was some pretty epic stuff! Even though the alternate universe thing threw me off a little at first.

So yeah, overall I can only say that Injustice is all I wanted it to be and more. Every character is unique, it's really hype to watch and everything is so flashy. <3

6 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Mon Apr 29, 2013 8:23 pm

munem939

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Going wild
I'll be honest and I only played two days' worth of the game at my cousin's house, on the Xbox. But, from my two days of playing, I came up with the conclusion:

Story
I'll be honest here and say that I didn't actually play the Story Mode in the game, I only watched a full walkthrough of it on YouTube. Nevertheless, I found the story to be somewhat interesting. It was pretty cool how the Joker won against Superman and how he caused Superman to turn "bad" (And killing Joker, which was a pretty cool scene at the time! :D); but the whole alternate dimension thing really put me off... :/ It just made me think why on Earth NRS thought of it. It's just like the MK9 story as when the world is in trouble, the future hero gets help from another dimension (Or in MK9's case, another time) and then it all screws up halfway through, and then they win in the end. While the story was interesting, it felt a bit bland.

Characters designs
Can I just say that I HATE some of the outfits on the DC Heros. Armour-styled clothing on the big characters (Like the Flash and Batman)? Really? I missed the classic DC Clothes. Having said that, some of the costumes are pretty cool, like Green Arrows' default costume and Batman's Batman Beyond outfit (Ah, memories! :3". The faces also don't look as what they should be :/

Gameplay
IGAU feels like a COMPLETELY new game, and as like Zero said, I thought that it was going to be just like MK9. I like having the back button as the block button, mainly because it allows me more control, when blocking against my opponent. Although I do miss those Dash Cancels... >3< When you first play it, it's hard to get used to since it is a completely new game. It's not like Street Fighter or Tekken, where all of the good aspects of what made the fighting system are still there. It takes a while to get used to the new system (Especially the 3 button attack system, excluding the Trait Button; since I'm a lot more used to fighting games having 1, 2, 4 or 6 button to attack). The trait system is pretty good :D Although there are a few flaws, such as Grundy's Trait which can cause over 30% damage and Catwoman's trait which (In my opinion) would be better off as a Special Move.

Also, when you end a match, the way they get up and then collapse on the floor looks so stupid! >3<

Interactables
I personally, don't like the interactables. sure it's unique and interesting at first, but after a while you get bored of it; especially the transitions which take too f**king long to finish! >3< Not to mention that they are also unblockable which can annoy me, and can also frustrate me during combos (You can do a combo which involves an interactable but unless you're in the EXACT spot in which the interactable works, you may as well have done a different combo).

Damage Outputs and Hitboxes
The damage outputs on some characters are just plain stupid and others are just too weak. It's like MK9's Jade all over again! xD Some characters can EASILY make 40% combos, without the need of a super metre - Like a said about Grundy's Trait. It's also easy to make combos which can take over 100% of your health, which annoys me! >3< The hit sparks on the screen, when blocking, makes it hard to see what is going on, as they look so similar to the hit sparks from when you DO hit your opponent

Extras
So far my "review" has been negative but I have to say... I absolutely LOVED the extras in this game! <3 They put a lot of content in STARS Lab, with cameos and being able to play characters that are not in the game. It's also like a tutorial mode for the characters you want to learn, which is pretty darn useful :)

I also love the iOS Injustice game to bits! :D It's really fun, and I love how the fighting system is very simple, yet pretty effective :3 (Though does lack in having an actual game plan when fighting). I like how you can get extra stuff in the Console version of IGAU from completing achievements in the iOS Version (Like Batman's costume from Batman: Beyond, after buying the character Batman in the iOS Game) and vice-versa :3

Online
I didn't play online, so I don't know about it too much! xD My sources tell me that the netcode in the game was purposely designed to lag so it will add a lot of impact to the game's aesthetics. Not sure if it's true or not, but if it is... Then that's STUPID! D:

Overall
Al in all, it's a big disappointment. It's too over-the-top (A LOT more than MK9!!!) and I find too many falws for it to be a good game. While the extra stuff to do are extremely good, it's all limited; and once they're done, they're done! The gameplay feels clunky and after playing it for 4 hours, it still felt as clunky as before, and including unbalanced OP Characters in the game. For me, it's a step-DOWN from MK9 :(

http://www.youtube.com/user/munem939

7 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Mon Apr 29, 2013 11:04 pm

Dictator

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Wild Ape
I liked the story because i like how characters and personalities change based on certain events happening or not, part of why im going for a psychology major.

The game is awesome, not cancelling is great IMO because it forces you to consider the consequences of your movement and enforces proper footsies. Playing it for 3 weeks has made me discover my playstyle past alternating between rushdown and turtling and has lvled me up in general.

Jumping is better in this game, the anti airs are not straight forward but you can always blow up someone jumping like an idiot.

Maining Black Adam, Aquaman and Superman. All of them thrive on the opponent being sloppy with BA in particular having good enough rushdown to keep me satisfied.

Also, the online is godlike.

8 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Wed May 01, 2013 10:17 am

Edge

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Seems alot of us feel the same about the same things. So far, I really don't like the game. Its far too quirky and the timing for inputs is ridiculously difficult. Jump-ins are stupid and blocking is annoying.

I trained with Shadow for like 4 hours yesterday. Learned how to fuzzy and deal with high-low mix up strings and a buncha other stuff. Fought a Green Arrow online today.. yammini his name was. Think I could block ANYTHING? He has a mid-low-overhead-low string which I could not block at all, even though the moment each hit connected I switched my thumb from D to B to D. I cant execute simple combos offline, much less on and practice mode is starting to bore me terribly. AA is stupid, d2 always trades with jump ins or favours the jump.. Just REALLY not enjoying this game at all. I know its probably just me and I suck/need to learn timing, reads and footsies but I don't think I can be bothered or have the time to learn a new game. I'm only playing it for the sole purpose of lvlling up

9 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Wed May 01, 2013 10:23 am

Edge

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and because of that, my hearts not in it. Its hard enough levelling up in a game you enjoy and are passionate about. Idk what I'ma do yet because I may think/feel different later, but I may go to TTT2 or see MK through to its death, then give up online gaming.

10 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Wed May 01, 2013 11:01 am

Shadow

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Wild Ape
FlawlessZero- wrote:Fought a Green Arrow online today.. yammini his name was.

Fought the same guy a few days ago, same problem; couldn't fuzzy and couldn't block low arrows. He'd always go for a low arrow after a D1, so after I saw the D1, I blocked low but still got hit. I also got pressured like crazy, couldn't poke out. Is it just me?

FlawlessZero- wrote:I cant execute simple combos offline

This just takes practice.

FlawlessZero- wrote:AA is stupid, d2 always trades with jump ins or favours the jump..

Omg yes. I fought a Doomsday who just belly flopped whenever he was in sweep range (well, MK sweep range) I tried D2 to AA but got beat by it every time. I tried blocking but it beat that too for some reason.[/quote]

11 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Wed May 01, 2013 6:21 pm

Dictator

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Wild Ape
Most characters have no reliable anti airs.

They have to take advantage of backdash invincibility frames instead or do something else.

If you wanna complain about no anti airs, be my guest, pick joker.

a solution for killer frost is to jump slide, its safe, unpunishable except on a ridiculously unfavourable read and lowers her hitbox.

another for green arrow is the overhead jumpback arrow

^ unless you got a great anti air you dont just try to do it to a big guys air D3, theyre specifically designed to have invisible hitboxes and be anti airable by most along with having an ambiguous crossup mixup, they WILL hit you before the animation shows any kind of impact.

Let me say this. Would you prefer to lvl up in a game the community of which in europe is complete trash and has no high lvl players, or do you prefer a MK based and influenced new fighting game with great online and competition where all you have to do right now is learn the mechanics and not deal with learning tech and moves and mixups or every damn character at once? Right now, the game is all about the basic mechanics and everyone is just finding his own shit, that won't last for long and you can bet that if you delay picking up this game when you finally realise MK EU is dead, you will find LOTS of daunting and not newbie-friendly shit has been found.

TL;DR the games mechanics are the easiest out of any game to get used to and not much character specific game changing tech has been found, pick it up now or receive surprise buttsex a year from now from all the new tech you will have to learn.



Last edited by Dictator Castro on Wed May 01, 2013 6:36 pm; edited 1 time in total

12 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Wed May 01, 2013 6:33 pm

Dictator

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Wild Ape
^ About KF, I meant slide under jumps.

Continuing, let me quote something from Nivek, our scenes best Tekken player who recently won the WB sponsored Injustice tournament here and the last official WB tournament in France, becoming champion of the WB tournament series. "If you're good in MK9 you will be good in Injustice" this is an actual quote, not paraphrasing anything. The game's mechanics only take a few days to really get used to, after that it's FULL of FOOTSIES - SPACING - MINDGAMES. THIS is why I consider Injustice to be SO MUCH BETTER than MK9 because no matter your character, if you're smarter than your opponent, you will win.

There is no bullshit and OP because everyone is basically BS and OP and every single character, even my former main Joker who is Omega tier in this game, can compete if you have the brains.

If you can't be bothered learning a new game when trying to get better at MK, let me tell you this. Who is there to teach you new things? Who is there to fight and learn? Who is smart enough to challenge YOU and dismiss the bullshit of the horrible MK9 netcode? Levelling up in one game means you level up in another because they are so similar. The last time I played MK for real was 1 week before the Injustice tournament here, that's over a month ago. Just a week ago I won a tournament vs a high lvl sonya just because Injustice preserved my MK fundamentals, I had input errors due to the built-in MK9 input delay but other than that I was performing barely under optimum.

Why? Because MK9 and Injustice are all about the same fundamentals and you do get better at both, MK9 fundamentals, Injustice fundamentals, you haven't realised one thing. Fundamentals are UNIVERSAL, you don't get better at one game when you play it and another when you finally play that, you get better as a player. If your goal isn't to discover new tech or learn matchups in MK9 then you can play Injustice without fear of "fundamental deterioration".

Also, if you're picking up a game, of course it's going to be tough at first, it's a whole new game. The "I have to learn a completely different game and the mechanics" does not apply when we ALL have to. Just the fact I absolutely despise learning new games and that I'm still writing paragraphs trying to convince any who are skeptical is proof of that.

This game, despite its initial appearance, fucking rocks. It may not look nice and fluid, but when you really get into it you can see it's a masterpiece among the current fighting games. It's made by NRS and just for that you should give it a shot, it was made to appeal all communities but especially the MK9 one.

13 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Wed May 01, 2013 7:10 pm

Edge

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We'll see.

14 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Wed May 01, 2013 8:38 pm

Shadow

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Wild Ape
@Castro - Who are you telling to pick the game up? We all have it. xD

For me it doesn't even feel like there's any footsies, it's just 'pressure until you HC your special' and do a bunch of mixups or zone. For me, that's all there is to it atm. In MK, dashing was a huge part of footsies, in Injust you just have to eat pressure. The back to block makes getting in on zoners so annoying, we're already restricted with the dash committing.

Each person I play, I feel like I'm playing smarter than them, yet still losing. I lost something like 0-8 to a crappy Flash player today. He did the same mixup; D3, into F2,1 (overhead), but I couldn't do anything about it. Not sure whether it's my character or what. It's also hard learning stuff when in online rooms, I think most people care more about winning the game than learning the match-up etc. I could be losing 0-15 and I'd still keep playing (Usually. Unless I'm in a crappy mood.)

I'm sick of inputs not coming out and me getting punished for it, it's not online, it's the game itself. On the surface it's a good and fun game to play, but the deeper you go, the more fun is lost for me. Before the game was released I said that I would just play casually, that's hard when you're surrounded by people that want to level up, so now I'm unsure about how serious to take this game. MK was pointless to take serious unless you play offline/have a scene. Injust online is pretty decent, so at least SOME skill will help online, unlike MK.

Right now, I'm just confused whether my terrible game-play is me not knowing the game that well, me just not doing the right things, or the game.

15 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Wed May 01, 2013 10:07 pm

Dictator

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Wild Ape
Shadow wrote:@Castro - Who are you telling to pick the game up? We all have it. xD

For me it doesn't even feel like there's any footsies, it's just 'pressure until you HC your special' and do a bunch of mixups or zone. For me, that's all there is to it atm. In MK, dashing was a huge part of footsies, in Injust you just have to eat pressure. The back to block makes getting in on zoners so annoying, we're already restricted with the dash committing.

Each person I play, I feel like I'm playing smarter than them, yet still losing. I lost something like 0-8 to a crappy Flash player today. He did the same mixup; D3, into F2,1 (overhead), but I couldn't do anything about it. Not sure whether it's my character or what. It's also hard learning stuff when in online rooms, I think most people care more about winning the game than learning the match-up etc. I could be losing 0-15 and I'd still keep playing (Usually. Unless I'm in a crappy mood.)

I'm sick of inputs not coming out and me getting punished for it, it's not online, it's the game itself. On the surface it's a good and fun game to play, but the deeper you go, the more fun is lost for me. Before the game was released I said that I would just play casually, that's hard when you're surrounded by people that want to level up, so now I'm unsure about how serious to take this game. MK was pointless to take serious unless you play offline/have a scene. Injust online is pretty decent, so at least SOME skill will help online, unlike MK.

Right now, I'm just confused whether my terrible game-play is me not knowing the game that well, me just not doing the right things, or the game.
I'm saying it so that people don't drop it.

It's you, I can counterpoke just fine online and all my strings and combos are coming out, and black adams combos are very timing specific and every execution step-up in his combos usually means an extra 10% so I always do them.

The game has built-in input delay, you just have to slowly do it, you can't just mash out a string fast. And before you tell me about input delay preventing counterpoking and shit, TTT2 online is never complained about, considered the best yet the game has 8f of input lag + online and people parry shit on reaction.

You just need to get used to the slower speed of the game.

Dashing is much more important in this game, backdashing has invincibility frames, that means the his D3 he was doing into f21 could be backdashed, it wasn't a frametrap at all, pressure in this game isn't like MK.

My character relies on whiff punishing, his dash speeds and recoveries are based on that, I can tell you that without knowing the properties of dashes you can't play this game properly, where you'd block something like a 212 from subzero after a D4 on hit, in injustice you'd simply backdash and whiff punish.

Pressure is a lot easier to escape in this game, ways to escape it have been put in the game and that's why most chars have very good pressure to make up for it.

The D3 you could:

Backdash
Neutral jump for full combo
D1 Arrow (uninterruptible by anything other than a D1 IF its blocked)
Throw
Jump

16 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Thu May 02, 2013 6:52 am

Loogie

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Going wild
@Castro

Don't take this personally, but the game is truly and utterly dissappointing once you start getting deep into it.
the sheer amount of brokeness takes the fun away, there is no fucking way to get in on zoners if your character DOES NOT HAVE the tools, so simply dash blocking does not work - EVER.
So just think of the number of bad matchups characters have, the matchup chart for alot of chars will be pretty much like Sheeva's (all 2-8s or 3-7s) and you got 10 or so chars in the cast who are all having superior winning matchups (9-1, 8-2, 7-3s).

The problem I am seeing with the MK community, is that you are too blinded by the whole "NRS did the game, so it's good no matter what" mentality. then you are like "learn the game and don't blame it for your losses".
@Castro - I don't think you will have any problme MUs with BA, then again can you explain to me why you dropped Joker???? because that char cannot get in on anyone with too many problem matchups, he's like a Sheeva of Injustice, the problem is that there are MANY Sheeva type chars with similar MU charts.

Another thing is, there are just too many damn specials in the game.
Players just use specials over and over again.
Meter building is crazy fast, you build meter practically for free, so chars who have zoning tools are at a great advantage with this. they can meter burn every 5 seconds to greater zoning effect.
Zoners also have advantage to use interactables, also chars with better mobility.
I mentioned the mobility issue for interactables on TYM but nobody cared to reply or didnt want to admit that even that was unfairly favoring only certain type of characters in the game.

the community of injustice, are only playing to win. no matter what it takes, just playing to win.
You can make all the right reads, and know your character inside out and still lose to scrubby tactics.

If what Nivek is saying is true, with all due respect and big props for him placing first in EU, then how the hell I keep losing to scrubs of MK which I used to beat without sweat! the notion that if you are good at MK you will be good at Injustice is not true at all - fighting mechanics of Injustice is very far from MK's and fundamentals are different. this is more like a SF/KOF type of game mechanics, even SF players are complaining about it since the game developers (NRS) were saying that this is a game to bring in both SF and MK players.

proof - compare the online rooms to that of MK9 when the game was released. in MK the rooms were all full, you could also tell the good from the bad players, bad players would lose in MK. in Injustice, you cannot tell the good from the bad, bad player beats the better players just by repeating a move, a special, a simple tactic.

Injustice is for EVERYONE. It is a simple and easy game, with simple and easy ways to win a match.

@ Castro - if you stuck with Joker, i am sure you would have agreed with everything in this post.

17 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Thu May 02, 2013 8:35 am

Edge

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Don't think NRS cares more about making a good fighting game than profits. They can't. If they want profits then they want longevity for the superhero fanboy sheeple that don't know how to really think effectively. MK was different to InJ in that with regards to development, they had way more control over decisions as it's their baby. When it's your creation it's not just about the money (though still more than not), but NRS would have had to cater to way more shareholders and investors and whomever else was funding/employing them. Public relations teams were OBVIOUSLY heavily involved with the development (just look at the story and certain character designs). Point is that MOST of the decision-making power they did have would only be because they were given it. The whole game reeks of BS propaganda. They spared no effort in advertising that NRS were developing it which is also a HUGE sales tactic especially when people build unconscious trusts in names, brands, groups etc without even considering

18 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Thu May 02, 2013 8:57 am

Edge

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that there is a chain of governance that goes much deeper, much less how it works.
I'm not saying InJ isn't created at all for high level play, of course it is, BUT the whole project was way bigger than MK ever was, and they have MANY more income-source streams to cater to aswell. When you're aiming a game towards a MUCH larger customer-base, the high-level side of thing will have less energy spent on it in favour of, say, I dunno, useless and stupidly long and boring super moves that make idiots go WOW THATS SO COOL IM A BADASS SUPERHERO or some shiz. Its way more noob friendly. Its just GEARED for button-mash brawlers. But high-level players trying to adjust? Most of us are suffering. The only ones not complaining are those truely high levels that have adjusted many dif times, don't know much about much except their occupation and video games, and have the mentality of "gottagetbetter gottagetbetter" because they're in a race they can never get out of or else they'll fail to keep up with the top competitio

19 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Thu May 02, 2013 9:16 am

Edge

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n.

I disagree with Shadow.. I think MK totally was a game worth learning seriously, even online. I never lose to anyone EVER that doesnt know frame data or hasnt consciously made an effort on their fundementals, except for lag and ONLY ever if its lag. After the first game I can always tell if I can overcome the lag or whether to just quit. My game thrives on my AA and footsie. If I cant solidly AA I suffer ALOT.. but most of the time I overcome it after 3-4 losses and start winning consistently. Yeah I get salty when I get wiped by Lao or Reptile or Raiden, but thats a netcode problem. The connection doesnt have to be perfect, just decent, and 99% of people cant get in on me. Just dont play people that abuse lag.. LKB and half of GRS crew would probably quit if MK had InJ's netcode and they all realised their shit dont work anymore and were forced to put in the time and effort to learn frames, not to mention actually fearing/respecting your opponent, learning that the games is not just charge in, press some

20 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Thu May 02, 2013 9:28 am

Edge

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buttons, hope for the best or whatever it is they do.

MK is the only fighting game I ever played seriously, so maybe I dunno much about them in general, but I know MK was created so that in offline, lagless conditions, the gap between high level and scrub level is gonna make it impossible for the scrub. Maybe it will be the same for InJ, but I bet the gap will be alot smaller because playing a char in total control is harder and less effective in InJ, and playing a char out of control is easier and more effective.

I'm not dropping it... yet. Time will tell.

EDIT: Also change your name dude. Seriously :| I'll agree to regular online practice with you on mics and to give this game a Month's serious hard work before settling on a final decision if you change it!

I know mine and everyone else's opinion of this game is obviously subject to change, so don't think i'm pre-judging it. I'm just stating the facts as I see them and my current opinions about those facts.

21 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Thu May 02, 2013 9:58 am

Bop_Sensei

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Game looks real purty - just my 2 cents

22 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Thu May 02, 2013 11:31 am

Dictator

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Wild Ape
FlawlessZero- wrote:buttons, hope for the best or whatever it is they do.

MK is the only fighting game I ever played seriously, so maybe I dunno much about them in general, but I know MK was created so that in offline, lagless conditions, the gap between high level and scrub level is gonna make it impossible for the scrub. Maybe it will be the same for InJ, but I bet the gap will be alot smaller because playing a char in total control is harder and less effective in InJ, and playing a char out of control is easier and more effective.

I'm not dropping it... yet. Time will tell.

EDIT: Also change your name dude. Seriously :| I'll agree to regular online practice with you on mics and to give this game a Month's serious hard work before settling on a final decision if you change it!

I know mine and everyone else's opinion of this game is obviously subject to change, so don't think i'm pre-judging it. I'm just stating the facts as I see them and my current opinions about those facts.
whats wrong with my name comrade?

and its not just MK that was designed to show skill gaps, ALL fighting games are designed like that.

23 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Thu May 02, 2013 12:38 pm

Dictator

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Wild Ape
Loogie wrote:@Castro

Don't take this personally, but the game is truly and utterly dissappointing once you start getting deep into it.
the sheer amount of brokeness takes the fun away, there is no fucking way to get in on zoners if your character DOES NOT HAVE the tools, so simply dash blocking does not work - EVER.
So just think of the number of bad matchups characters have, the matchup chart for alot of chars will be pretty much like Sheeva's (all 2-8s or 3-7s) and you got 10 or so chars in the cast who are all having superior winning matchups (9-1, 8-2, 7-3s).

The problem I am seeing with the MK community, is that you are too blinded by the whole "NRS did the game, so it's good no matter what" mentality. then you are like "learn the game and don't blame it for your losses".
@Castro - I don't think you will have any problme MUs with BA, then again can you explain to me why you dropped Joker???? because that char cannot get in on anyone with too many problem matchups, he's like a Sheeva of Injustice, the problem is that there are MANY Sheeva type chars with similar MU charts.

Another thing is, there are just too many damn specials in the game.
Players just use specials over and over again.
Meter building is crazy fast, you build meter practically for free, so chars who have zoning tools are at a great advantage with this. they can meter burn every 5 seconds to greater zoning effect.
Zoners also have advantage to use interactables, also chars with better mobility.
I mentioned the mobility issue for interactables on TYM but nobody cared to reply or didnt want to admit that even that was unfairly favoring only certain type of characters in the game.

the community of injustice, are only playing to win. no matter what it takes, just playing to win.
You can make all the right reads, and know your character inside out and still lose to scrubby tactics.

If what Nivek is saying is true, with all due respect and big props for him placing first in EU, then how the hell I keep losing to scrubs of MK which I used to beat without sweat! the notion that if you are good at MK you will be good at Injustice is not true at all - fighting mechanics of Injustice is very far from MK's and fundamentals are different. this is more like a SF/KOF type of game mechanics, even SF players are complaining about it since the game developers (NRS) were saying that this is a game to bring in both SF and MK players.

proof - compare the online rooms to that of MK9 when the game was released. in MK the rooms were all full, you could also tell the good from the bad players, bad players would lose in MK. in Injustice, you cannot tell the good from the bad, bad player beats the better players just by repeating a move, a special, a simple tactic.

Injustice is for EVERYONE. It is a simple and easy game, with simple and easy ways to win a match.

@ Castro - if you stuck with Joker, i am sure you would have agreed with everything in this post.
I never said I couldn't win vs zoners using joker, the reason I dropped him for adam was FIRST because adam suited my playstyle much more and I wasn't willing to go through with another subzero. If I want to? Yeah, I can win with Joker even though he's unexplored and badly designed, players win, not characters.

This is a new game, you can't expect not to get stomped by the new mechanics then say "this game is trash". That's what prince is saying, he does keep playing the game though. You're acting like all the casuals that don't get zoning at first then leave the game for good, even have the exact same arguements. Just because something beats you when you don't even know the mechanics of it on week 2 of the game it's unfair?

Just because YOU haven't found a way through zoning yet doesn't mean that it's a noob-favoring game.

Pick up ANY zoner for a week and then play my joker if you think it's so easy to zone. I'll even stop playing him for the whole week you'll be picking up the zoner of your choice.

Yeah, you're comparing casuals who picked up the game to find out how many people who know about fighting games picked it up? Really? And I do see full chatrooms, every single night. Also, why do tournament players who have decided to main grundy, joker, sinestro, shazam, bane, lex, catwoman etc don't complain about zoning?

Interactibles, so because noone wanted to agree with you, they're overpowered? Really? Both sides can use interactibles, power characters can even destroy them for good.

What did the SF community say and in which thread? I happen to have an account on shoryuken... Most of the people there think NRS outdid themselves and some people complain about the MK animations and how it's much more like MK and so do the trolls.

Dashblocking does not work? This coming from someone who you who dropped the best forward dasher who can continuously cancel to a 4 hits of armour dash that leads to 40% and setups?

24 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Thu May 02, 2013 2:39 pm

Loogie

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Going wild
OK ...

1)the game does favor zoners
2)its too easy to abuse the game mechanics, what has been discovered so far all point towards that. if any new revelation comes by that quashes all possible abuse, loops, or whatever then i reserve my judgement until that time
3)the Grundy example, ok. Grundy cannot get in on zoners - you said it yourself. game doesnt let you block during dashing or cancel into anything but committing to dash. if you committ to a dash you have to be sure that the coast is clear; pokes - specials - normals - jumps - interactables - etc. ONLY then your dash is made safe. dashing in between projectiles isn't easy at all. i have worked very hard on this but it is still very frustrating. we have to know the frame data for dashing to know on WHO you can dash in and on WHO you cannot! vs Sinestro with Aquaman i was very focused on getting a dash in after a blocked overhead rock but i got hit with a second overhead just when i started to dash! so, WTF?! that rock should be like -20 from the frame data. how come i cannot dash?! how many frames does Aquaman need to dash forward and escape it?!
4) i dont want to play you, what will that prove? you will win all matches most probably. this game makes me lose my temper. and you can even do that following simple tactics, my character cannot get in. vs BA with Grundy, do you mean to tell me that the matchup isnt like an 8-2 for BA? how many chars in MK had 8-2 MUs??? not alot.
5)tournament players respect the game probably, they dont want to abuse tactics or pick up broken zoners. plus, listen to this because it's true and i'd cut my dick off if i was wrong: Tournament players, and pros who tested the game and worked with NRS are probably getting paid to DEFEND the game and promote it in the community. they are totally biased when it comes to addressing views such as mine and others regarding the retardedness of zoning and stupid mechanics
6)Interactables ... ok, now hear me out: DS zoning you and a hovercraft comes his way on the Watchtower stage. you are trying to get around his zoning by 'dash blocking'. you WILL eat that interactable for 18%! ok, now tell me how a zoner wasnt favored in that situation? this is one examples - there are plenty more.
7)Sorry not SF, Tekken i think. that EVO guy Belial (top 8 player) and a regular, also contributed to MK at the start. made a very good thread about Injustice Zoning. I suggest you check it out. It's not only casuals complaining.
8)Dashblocking does not work, it doesnt exist with some characters... if BA can dashblock because he has the best recovering dash, then you are not being fair :)

Peace

25 Re: Thoughts on Injustice on Thu May 02, 2013 2:43 pm

Loogie

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Going wild
one more thing.

if MK10 is anything like Injustice, then fuck it in advance! i aint getting it

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