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Anti-crossovers.

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1 Anti-crossovers. on Fri Feb 08, 2013 11:47 am

Edge

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I think it would be a good idea for us all to start actively discussing theory fighting. Crossovers are a REAL pain in the ass for all of us even if you know how to read and react to them. I've been practicing for a while now and I don't seem to be getting far. I've been trying Scorp's D1, Smoke's standing 2 and d1, and Sub's 22. I managed once or twice with Scorp, had more success with Smokes 2 than d1, and Sub eats combo everytime. In fact I get AA crossovers pretty frequently by complete accident most of the time and have become a master at converting them into combos, but that doesn't help me in the conscious game because its luck off a bad read.

Really there are 2 types of spacing for crossover, which is when pressure leaves you right next to eachother (Scorp's 11) or with slight pushback (Scorp's 21). Any further back they'll land in front. I'd like some general advice on spacing and reading based on both of those ranges.

When pressure leaves you at neutral frames, you can d1 anti-air any jump, with close spacing providing there's lnot much lag. So, whats the most disadvantage you can be at before his jump will clear your d1?

What am I doing wrong when I try to AA them when they reach the other side?

Ruby, Taco, Loog, Dan, what are your approaches to these situations? What are the options after cross-up set-ups?

I encourage everyone else to ask about their chars too, and practice this shiz.

2 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Fri Feb 08, 2013 1:29 pm

EarlyReflections

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Wild Ape
i have the same questions,and i can't achieve a good result yet...
Suomi is very good in anti-crossovers,let's hear what he has to say as as well..

3 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:07 pm

Dictator

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Wild Ape
you dont go for crossover antiairs online when you wanna win

the timing is extremely strict, its hard enough offline if you dont know how to, online its near impossible, in the grs tournament i tried antiairing crossups all day when offline i dont fail them and i lost.

uppercut instead of D1

what you should be doing offline though is dash away from crossups on reaction

4 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:12 pm

Dan Bavian

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After some testing I have observed that some strings like laos 21 or scorpions 11 "squeezes" the hitboxes togheter, and when done into crossovers it creates more space between the crouching player and the JIP. There for will give enough space to do the D1-Anticrossover before the jip hits you.
While other strings that gives pushback makes the "jumping arc" fall closer to the crouching player and make the JIP hit earlier. And will make the timeframe to connect the d1 more difficult. Remember these are only observations, I could be wrong.

5 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:16 pm

Dan Bavian

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Dictator Castro wrote:you dont go for crossover antiairs online when you wanna win

the timing is extremely strict, its hard enough offline if you dont know how to, online its near impossible, in the grs tournament i tried antiairing crossups all day when offline i dont fail them and i lost.

uppercut instead of D1

what you should be doing offline though is dash away from crossups on reaction

I've started to land them quite often. But there are certain players that i cant land them on. I dont know if it's a lag problem or their choice of string before they crossovers that does it. But I never dash to land them.

6 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:18 pm

Shadow

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Wild Ape
Dictator Castro wrote:dash away from crossups on reaction

This is what I told Reflections (:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Going for AC's online usually results in a free combo for the opponent, same with AA's a lot of the time.

I get AC's about 1/40 times. Since playing Freddy I've gotten a couple with his D1, but because getting them is so inconsistent, I rarely do anything after hitting it so all it does is stop the free pressure that the opponent would have got if I never went for the AC.

7 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:21 pm

Dan Bavian

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Also, not holding block while being crossover'd seems to create more space

8 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Fri Feb 08, 2013 11:52 pm

Bop_Sensei

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Any one thinks skype has reduced activity in the forum?

9 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Sat Feb 09, 2013 12:18 am

Dan Bavian

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Kind of. I was happy for Zero bringing this up. But disapointed that few wanted to discuss this. I'm afraid that people don't bother comming by the forum after the chatting got moved to skype. I think discussing theory fighting is in everyone's interest.

10 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Sat Feb 09, 2013 6:48 am

misskiss88

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I would love if we discuss this, since crossovers are a big problem of mine and I don't know how to deal with them. Are we gonna discuss it for each character or more in general?

11 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Sat Feb 09, 2013 11:48 am

Edge

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I don't have much time and I wanna hit MK for a bit. I'm actually surprised so many responded in just a day. I'll reply more in-depth tonight when I finish work.

My question still stands about how the frames work for jumping. After a 3d12, d1 I can AA any attempt to jump, and its neutral frames. So why can people cross me over when I hit a d3 and go for a 2? d3 is +3 on hit and 2 is 9frames, It's still a 6 frame advantage from standing neutral position. I hope I'm making sense lol.

@Miss I was hoping we could get the fundamentals of AA and crossovers down AND go into char-specific stuff.

Ruby, you're consistent as fck. I'm afraid to do anything vs you because your AA, AC and poke game are so solid but it's about the mind-set it gives your opponent. I lose to you cuz of psyche BS and play like a moron 90% of the time. If you can master dis shiz then there's no reason any of us can't but first we gotta understand it, then we gotta work really hard. It's about removing your opponents options.

12 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:49 pm

Dictator

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Wild Ape
get real, this is online, i have no problem crossup AAing offline but i never bother with it online

and they jump to avoid your d3, not your 2, if youre gonna read a crossup then D1 first



Last edited by Dictator Castro on Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:52 pm; edited 1 time in total

13 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:51 pm

Taco

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Wild Ape
Dictator Castro wrote:you dont go for crossover antiairs online when you wanna win

the timing is extremely strict, its hard enough offline if you dont know how to, online its near impossible, in the grs tournament i tried antiairing crossups all day when offline i dont fail them and i lost.

uppercut instead of D1

what you should be doing offline though is dash away from crossups on reaction

This! Dashing away and punishing right after landing works best for me.

https://www.facebook.com/themixicanNL

14 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Sat Feb 09, 2013 2:34 pm

Edge

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Ruby, cut the BS. I watch you do it all the damned time. You say get real but you tried it in KotH.. in the finals.. Against Prince of ALL people. On a good connection it can be done consistently and you know this. I watch others do it. Yeah there are safe options like dashing. Hell you could just JK away everytime there's a gap for the safest option. Point is you would learn to judge by first round which option is best based on lag. You can't tell me "Don't bother even on good con" and yet do it yourself >_>

15 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Sat Feb 09, 2013 2:44 pm

Edge

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Dictator Castro wrote:and they jump to avoid your d3, not your 2, if youre gonna read a crossup then D1 first

Oh and no, I mean I d3, it hits, both standing, I'm +3, I go for 2, they go for jump, their jump clears 2, and I get crossed over into combo. How is this different to a 6 frame d1 from neutral, a 9f 2 from +3 which AAs them into d1 sb > full combo?

16 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Sat Feb 09, 2013 3:03 pm

Dictator

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Wild Ape
FlawlessZero- wrote:Ruby, cut the BS. I watch you do it all the damned time. You say get real but you tried it in KotH.. in the finals.. Against Prince of ALL people. On a good connection it can be done consistently and you know this. I watch others do it. Yeah there are safe options like dashing. Hell you could just JK away everytime there's a gap for the safest option. Point is you would learn to judge by first round which option is best based on lag. You can't tell me "Don't bother even on good con" and yet do it yourself >_>
scorpion has one of the best if not the best D1 AAs and i ate at least 5 combos because i tried it, just because i was stupid enough to go for it doesnt mean its good online

17 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Sat Feb 09, 2013 3:06 pm

Dictator

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Wild Ape
i know what you mean, HOWEVER

D1s AA from neutral, D3s dont, set the cpu to jump and poke just as they jump, which poke do you see giving you a full combo?

AKA D3s are crossuped for almost free, main reason why i crossup if my opp goes autopilot D3

18 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Fri Feb 15, 2013 1:47 am

Dan Bavian

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[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Here is a list of options for different characters

19 Re: Anti-crossovers. on Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:57 am

misskiss88

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Thanks dan:)

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